Battlezone 1
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Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
http://www.battlezone1.org/exceeding-maximun-unit-limit-bug-t1041.html		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Firestorm29 [ 06 Jan 2010, 15:18 ]
Post subject:  Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
This is one of a few things I mentioned with Ken and I thought it would be a wise idea to post about it to atleast make people aware of it. I'm alittle leery bout posting details about how cause the bug to happen ever since that one game a couple days ago where someone used it as a deception tactic.

What happens is when you manage to pull off the trick, the recycler/factory will pump out the unit you were building, however the unit is unable to accept commands. The affected unit is able to still attack and fire at targets normally, though. Said person managed to use this bug to construct a few NSDF walkers and made it appear as if this was his main force. He then used his real force and attacked my base when I got too far away to respond.

I gave Ken the low-down on how to actually trigger this bug, but if you guys want some more info, lemme know. Also, I don't remember who did this or what their IP was, so I can't help there...
Author:  Mr. Spock [ 06 Jan 2010, 15:51 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
I don't see a reason why would this bug/glitch go over PM's. We should be grateful Ken is visting this forum, responding to all our (silly) questions, so no need to bug him with PM's too (I'm mostly referring here to the silly scrapmakers group :)).

About this bug/glitch... when you have, let's say, 10 offensive units, you jump out of your tank and tell some offensive unit to pick you up. Before AI pilot jumps into your tank, you can "order" a new offensive unit from recycler and/or factory. What happens next depends on who's faster; factory producing new unit or AI pilot jumping into empty vehicle. The slower one becomes (11th) unselectable unit. You can repeat this over and over.
Author:  Firestorm29 [ 06 Jan 2010, 17:43 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
One thing I might mention was I think we were discussing this before I had patched up relations with you guys. :)

I found that you really don't need to have an AI tank come to you, or atleast the variation I found of this bug. I wound up pulling it off when I had 9 units in offensive, hop out of tank takes place of the final spot, therefore the new offensive unit is built and unable to accept commands since it isn't in the list. Of course I had to choose a walker when I triggered it in Single Player, having that Sasquach's big grin staring at me as if it was happy to be an over-sized lawn gnome. :/

Thinking it over, other than tricking an opponent, it's hardly very effective to exploit. You have a pilot and atleast 5 scrap if you built a scout/fighter just sitting there unable to do anything but attack anything that gets near. Granted, you could shunt around the unit, but it's still fairly cumbersome.
Author:  Mr. Spock [ 06 Jan 2010, 18:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
Quote:
One thing I might mention was I think we were discussing this before I had patched up relations with you guys. :)

That's not sorted out yet, but don't bring it here, leave it for the coffee topic.

Quote:
I found that you really don't need to have an AI tank come to you, or atleast the variation I found of this bug. I wound up pulling it off when I had 9 units in offensive, hop out of tank takes place of the final spot, therefore the new offensive unit is built and unable to accept commands since it isn't in the list.

Like that your tank became 10th offensive unit, so you basically described the same thing as I did.

Quote:
Thinking it over, other than tricking an opponent, it's hardly very effective to exploit.

Everyone can do it, it takes precious time and risk to do it and the most important - it costs scrap, so I don't consider it a nasty exploit. Furthermore, having urself in a czar, 10 grendels as ur wingmen and 10 golems at home sounds very effective. :P
Author:  Sporkinator [ 06 Jan 2010, 23:23 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximum unit limit bug
I thought about posting about this, but wasn't sure since I couldn't determine myself whether or not it's a "bug". If it is a bug, it sounds hard to "fix". If your factory or recycler is building 10th offensive unit and you hop out to snipe, that unit gets wasted in my opinion, since it can't accept commands. But let's say the building process were automatically canceled... nope, that's no good, that would be frustrating to say the least. Let's say you re-enter your vehicle and now have 9 offense + 1 that can't take orders. Would it be acceptable that upon re-entering vehicle that one that can't take orders moves into 10th slot and falls in under your command? I personally go out of my way to avoid having 11th unit when I play. A lot of times, I tell recycler to make scout and factory to make tank as a quick way to replenish lost offensive units, but not before checking to make sure I have 2 offensive slots available. :P
Author:  Ultraken [ 13 Jan 2010, 02:22 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
There's no real reason to make "spillover" units uncommandable, so I'll try removing the team slot check from the "can I command this unit?" test. It should be selectable with the reticule after that. Updates as events warrant... :)
Author:  Mr. Spock [ 10 Mar 2010, 13:52 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
I see nothing was done concerning this, which is good, cause suggested fix would change the game too much, allowing more than 10 units of specific group. Having 20 bombers (10 selectable with the reticule) wouldn't be BZ as we know it.

I suggest to leave that 11th unit unselectable until one of 1-10 units is destroyed. Then that 11th unit should simply take destroyed unit's place and become selectable.
Author:  Sporkinator [ 10 Mar 2010, 16:34 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
Mr. Spock wrote:
I suggest to leave that 11th unit unselectable until one of 1-10 units is destroyed. Then that 11th unit should simply take destroyed unit's place and become selectable.
That would be awesome. I don't build over 10 units on purpose, but in the case I do it by accident, I will eventually have control of the unit if I engage in a battle and lose 1 unit. :)
Author:  Ultraken [ 17 Mar 2010, 05:29 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
The Recycler and Factory grey out items when that category fills up, so it's not something that comes up too often. Building from the Recycler and Factory simultaneously can get you an 11th unit, and the Barracks seems to have no team slot restrictions at all, but making those units commandable wouldn't be a game-breaker since you'd have to give them orders in person. (They'd merely be less useless than before.)
Author:  Sporkinator [ 17 Mar 2010, 06:17 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
You can get over 10 units without doing simultaneous building with Recycler and Factory. Those who know how to do it can exploit it and make 20 scavengers or more. Having 10+xth unit fill 1-10 slots as they become available will prevent the exploit.
Author:  Ultraken [ 17 Mar 2010, 09:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
Would fixing the Barracks put a stop to that?
Author:  Sporkinator [ 17 Mar 2010, 09:51 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximum* unit limit bug
Ultraken wrote:
Would fixing the Barracks put a stop to that?
What is there to "fix" in barracks? This isn't about barracks...

1. Build 10 scavs.
2. Have 1 pick you up.
3. Order recycler to build 10th scav and hop out of your scav.
4. When the scav is done, re-enter your scav and go back to step 3.

When you hop out, the empty scav takes up the 10th slot, so new scav will be scav 11. When you get back in the scav, it frees up slot 10, and you can do it again, order a scav to be built and re-enter your scav, making scav #12, etc.

If unit #11 became unit #10 once the 10th slot was free again, it would be more difficult to have over 10 AI units of a given kind (offense, defense, utility).

Another reason to do this, is what if I am building my 10th offensive AI unit and I hop out of my tank to attempt to snipe my opponent and the 10th unit is finished building? Well, what was intended to be unit 10 is now unit 11. When I get back in my tank, unit 11 should become unit 10, that way I didn't accidentally waste scrap on an uncommandable unit, and I have the 10 units that I wanted.
Author:  Ultraken [ 17 Mar 2010, 23:16 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
I was thinking pilots from Barracks were a major source of extra vehicles, but it would be a lot less convenient than the method you describe.

Compacting the team slots would indeed go a long way towards fixing that.
Author:  Fly [ 18 Mar 2010, 22:40 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximum* unit limit bug
Sporkinator wrote:
Ultraken wrote:
Would fixing the Barracks put a stop to that?
What is there to "fix" in barracks? This isn't about barracks...

1. Build 10 scavs.
2. Have 1 pick you up.
3. Order recycler to build 10th scav and hop out of your scav.
4. When the scav is done, re-enter your scav and go back to step 3.

When you hop out, the empty scav takes up the 10th slot, so new scav will be scav 11. When you get back in the scav, it frees up slot 10, and you can do it again, order a scav to be built and re-enter your scav, making scav #12, etc.

If unit #11 became unit #10 once the 10th slot was free again, it would be more difficult to have over 10 AI units of a given kind (offense, defense, utility).

Another reason to do this, is what if I am building my 10th offensive AI unit and I hop out of my tank to attempt to snipe my opponent and the 10th unit is finished building? Well, what was intended to be unit 10 is now unit 11. When I get back in my tank, unit 11 should become unit 10, that way I didn't accidentally waste scrap on an uncommandable unit, and I have the 10 units that I wanted.


Oh, like this? :lol:

Image
Author:  furykiller [ 19 Mar 2010, 07:18 ]
Post subject:  Re: Exceeding maximun unit limit bug
BAHAHAHAHAH ROFL
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